Nigel Ayers, Randy Greif & Robin Storey:

Oedipus Brain Foil Interview

An unusual collaborative effort has yielded the experimental triptych Oedipus Brain Foil which draws on the sound-construction skills of three veteran artists, each with their own histories and sonic styles. Randy Greif, Nigel Ayers and Robin Storey gathered sound sources to pass on to the next, and then modified sounds given to them by the other in an attempt to form a communal voice. I'd like to thank each of the artists for taking the time to answer my questions, as well as Charles Powne at Soleilmoon, and Terry Allan Bennett (creator of the Rapoon website) for getting questions through to Robin for me. Do yourself a favor and check out the stupendous Soleilmoon website.

Nigel Ayers, Randy Greif & Robin Storey:

Oedipus Brain Foil Interview

(AmbiEntrance© - 1999)

AmbiEntrance: How did the concept for the Oedipus Brain Foil triptych come about?

Storey: The idea for a triptych came about by chance really. I mentioned to Charles at Soleilmoon that I was doing collaborations with Randy and Nigel and it was Charles' idea to get Randy and Nigel together to complete the triangle.

Greif: When Robin had toured through Los Angeles two years ago and stayed with me a few days, we had an opportunity to play on the same bill one evening. We both had been interested in what the other had done and decided to work on a collaboration together. Robin was also working with Nigel on a collaborative project which would be released on Soleilmoon, and Charles came up with the idea of completing the triangle by having Nigel and I work together, and then releasing it as a triptych as well as separate CDs. The three of us liked the idea and went with it.

Charles came up with the idea of morphing our faces for the cover art. The rest of the cover art was based on paintings by Robin and digitally altered by Charles and myself with the help of Tracey Roberts at Vestige. So this project is a melding of ideas and inputs on all levels.

Ayers: I think I suggested to Robin that we could do some sort of postal collaboration. I'd done a live collaboration with him in Vienna in 1991 (back in his Zoviet France days) that you can hear on the Nocturnal Emissions Energy Exchange LP, and we'd worked on organising one or two projects in Newcastle when I lived up there. I liked the organic and painterly textures of his solo music, I also thought he would be very straightforward to work with, as he tends to get on with his music. I think for him like me, the music is more of a spiritual than an ego thing. The CD titles are all anagrams generated from the title Robin came up with- Perfidious Albion - which is from Shakespeare I believe.

AmbiEntrance: Robin, what can you tell us about Perfidious Albion? Whose idea was it to create anagrams, and who did them?

Storey: Perfidious Albion was a title that came to mind after the music had reached a certain point. Both Nigel and myself exist pretty much outside of any easy classification and apart from any cliques or trends, especially those that revolve around being in in London. This album reflected a side of both of us that kicks against safety and has a sense of humour. It was Randy's idea to create anagrams and he did them all as far as I am aware.

AmbiEntrance: Randy, did you come up with your anagrams manually or use a computer program?

Greif: I first used Scrabble tiles. And came up with a bunch. Then went to an anagram generator and got a LOT more. We sifted through them to choose Nail Of Pious Bride and Build A Poison Fire and finally, Oedipus Brain Foil for the title of the set itself. I don't remember if they came from manual letter movement or computer generation, except that I know that the name Oedipus Brain Foil was created manually by my friend and writer Alva Svoboda using the unique and patented Scrabble tile system.

AmbiEntrance: I ran Perfidious Albion through the anagram generator at the Anagram Insanity website, and came up with a few more. Had you considered any of these? - Diaper fusion boil, Forbid pious alien, Birdie fouls piano, Profile audio bins, Fairies pound boil, Boundaries foil pi?

Greif: There were 1,000s. I narrowed the list down to about a dozen and sent them to Robin and Nigel for their picks. One title that I rather liked was Libido Rape Fusion, which Nigel rejected as having too negative an implication.

AmbiEntrance: Can you explain how the process worked (as far as one person starting and another finishing, etc.)?

Greif: I sent Robin unfinished material for him to use in any way he saw fit. In his case he mixed portions of it with his own material. He may have sampled the source material I sent him too. I don't know.

The material I received from Nigel I decided to alter extremely without adding new sounds. His source was sampled using mostly very short segments usually one second or less, creating rhythms, drones, or snips of music. The samples were loaded in the computer and altered more, then finally overlaying some of Nigel's material using some Digital Sound Processing.

Ayers: We exchanged DATs through the mail, basically I sent Randy a collection of electronic pieces I'd been unable to finish, along with some minimal pieces I'd done on the two harmoniums I own (one's late of a Welsh chapel, the other is a portable one purchased in Nepal).

The piece I sent Randy was an album length piece that I'd taken so far and never been able to finish satisfactorily- it needed something doing but I wasn't exactly sure what, so his input really made it into a fresh new piece.

AmbiEntrance: Who named each disc's tracks... the giver or the receiver? Where were your own titles coming from (or leading to)?

Greif: Nigel named the tracks on my collaboration with him (Build A Poison Fire) and I named the tracks on the collaboration with Robin (Nail Of Pious Bride) I asked Robin to assign the track titles to whichever seemed appropriate. For me titles have usually either been random and just fun or a mnemonic device used while working on a track. I don't like to get too specific with titles that lead a listener in a certain direction.

Ayers: Track titles for Build a Poison Fire came from me. Robin made the titles for Perfidious Albion.

Storey: I did all the names in Perfidious Albion. I wanted it to be a very English album and I think it succeeds in this. I think Perfidious Albion is from King Lear. Anyway the rest of the titles reflect a sense of Olde England. Randy named all the tracks on our album.

AmbiEntrance: Robin, you also created the cover art for OBF. Were the paintings done before, during or after the recordings, and were they specifically for this project?

Storey: All the paintings were done after the project was finished and were specific to this project. I wanted to convey a sense of fragmentary unity. The original idea was to paint fake ancient mosaics which had attained an artistic state different from their original through erosion, the passage of time, any process, natural or otherwise, which had altered the image leaving a mark of its own. In a way, I wanted the paintings to reflect the restructuring processes of the music.

AmbiEntrance: Was there ever any working together physically, or was everything done separately?

Ayers: Basically, we just sent DATs backwards and forwards until the pieces seemed to gel. What's emerged is quite different to the original tapes I sent out....it's worked like a kind of Chinese whispers.

Everything was done separately, and once the tapes were sent on, I think we each did what we felt to be our bit, and then abandoned it to whatever processing the next person felt it needed.

Greif: Everything was separate. At least as far as my work with the others.

AmbiEntrance: Did you do anything differently than you normally do, production- or composition-wise?

Ayers: Yes, submitting to someone else's manipulation of my work. Usually I control every stage, but in this case the work was very open.

Storey: Incorporating someone else's ideas and music into your own meant a slightly different approach. I was aware of trying to keep an original impression of the other's work and not trying to overwhelm this with my own thoughts.

Greif: Well, that question would apply much more to the collaboration with Nigel in that I composed a lot more than the other. And yes, like I was saying in a previous answer, I laid down some restrictions to add no new material--only to work with the material Nigel had sent. I'm sure Nigel would have a hard time recognizing some of the material here, though.

I had heard Robin's work before I really settled into working on the collaboration with Nigel, and I think that colored my approach to working with Nigel's sounds. I wanted something with its own voice but still consistent with the other disc. Also, it can be easy to completely obliterate a sound source with electronic processing and I wanted to retain the general sound and feel of Nigel's source material.

AmbiEntrance: Were there any rules regarding what kinds of sounds you could pass on, or what you could do with source material you received?

Ayers: We didn't really make any rules, but perhaps there were a few unspoken rules since we were all aware of each others' earlier work.

Greif: On the two CDs I was involved in there were no rules imposed except the rule I had placed on myself to use Nigel's material exclusively.

Storey: No, not that I know of. I think we all did our own filtering of material and ideas without discussing it.

AmbiEntrance: In your opinion, was it better to give or receive in this case?

Greif: They were both great. The fun part about giving to Robin was the surprise of how it would be returned to me. The material sent to him was a lot of odds and ends that had been created for the most part before the collaboration began. I was delighted to hear the final work come back from Robin and was extremely pleased with what he'd done with it. The Build A Poison Fire was definitely a lot more concentrated work on my part--much more challenging.

Storey: It was better to receive - I have a problem sending out anything that I don't think is finished, so sending raw material was difficult. I kept trying to do something more to it and before you know it there was suddenly a near finished piece.

AmbiEntrance: Nigel, of the pieces you completed from Robin's, did you have a favorite?

Ayers: I think the CD is effective as an overall piece and I just like to let it run.

AmbiEntrance: What about from Randy's remixes of your sources?

Ayers: Likewise.

AmbiEntrance: Robin, of the pieces you completed from Randy's, did you have a favorite?

Storey: I tend to think of albums as a whole so selecting tracks as favourites isn't something I do much. There are favourite moments in things. Subtle transitions, dramatic changes, whatever. I liked the feel of the material with Randy, it's open and expansive.

AmbiEntrance: What about from Nigel's remixes of your sources?

Storey: The way things worked with Nigel was much more brutal in a sense. Things were mercilessly chopped and changed as the material went back and forth until it settled into a finished state. I like both.

AmbiEntrance: Randy, of the pieces you completed from Nigel's, did you have a favorite?

Greif: I rarely go back and listen to my own work once it's released, but when I do, I find that my tastes and opinions towards them change over time. I'm quite happy with the entire project, but really couldn't say what tracks are favorites. I also find that my taste concerning my own tracks often differ dramatically to others so I hate to lay down my bias.

AmbiEntrance: What about from Robin's remixes of your sources?

Greif: I can say that I was very pleased with all of the work that Robin did with my source material.

AmbiEntrance: How long did the project take altogether? Am I correct in assuming the 2nd phase of altering the sources took longer than the 1st phase of gathering them?

Storey: I think it took about six months to get done. I was slow getting off the mark because I was busy with lots of other stuff that needed to be finished. Once I got going the development was quite rapid. The second stuff definitely took longer in my case. I spent a fair amount of time doing some thinking in the background about it before I set to work messing around with sounds.

Greif: The project took about a year, and then some delays in getting the packaging done and the release actually out.

Ayers: Length of time - I'm such a one for recycling, it's hard to keep track of just how long some pieces took. Some of the pieces I contributed I'd had on the go for several years already, and some were brand spanking new.

AmbiEntrance: Was this a very serious project for you, or more of a fun thing?

Storey: It was both. There is obviously respect for the other musicians and so in one sense there was a serious aspect to working together, in another there was something of a sense of liberation. There were elements included which might not have made it into a Rapoon project.

Greif: Definitely both. I was really happy to be working with two people I've respected for so long. If anything, I was extra attentive because of my respect towards them and I wanted the finished product to be something they would at least be comfortable releasing.

Ayers: It was as serious as any other project I've undertaken.

AmbiEntrance: Did anyone try to stump anyone else with purposely difficult-to-use source material?

Ayers: Nah! What would be the point of that? That sounds like a scene from Amadeus. We didn't work that way. Personally, I don't approach music as a display of virtuosity and I don't accept the idea that any source material is more difficult to use than any other. Unless of course you are bound to rigid formulas, which I don't think either Randy or Robin are. The project was collaboration, not a competition.

Storey: I don't think anyone tried to stump anyone else, although the source material Nigel sent to me was very eclectic.

Greif: I can only speak for the source material I sent to Robin, and no, I wanted to send him stuff that would be easy to manipulate such as electronic rhythms which could be slowed down for a very different effect or sounds which could be layered into a distant sounding backdrop. I sent him a lot of material. I think about 90 minutes.

AmbiEntrance: Do you think the sounds would be very different if the giving/receiving order had been reversed? (Or maybe you'll try that with a Part Two?)

Storey: Yes, I think the material could have transmuted many ways and directions, but that's also true of any material, at least in my case it is. It depends on how you respond at the time.

Greif: I think the CDs would have been very different had the orders been reversed. Even though we were trying to come up with a morphed voice which lays somewhere in the middle of the 3 discs, it will not amount to more than an attempt, in that, as you alluded to, we may have quite different results if we had switched roles. Even recreating the project with the same givers and receivers would probably yield very different results because we aren't fixed to style, mood, equipment or perception. I'd be open to doing a Part Two, but the idea has not been discussed..

interview by Link O'Rama (a.k.a. David J. Opdyke)

This interview originally appeared on AmbiEntrance January 27, 1999